POINT BY POINT SUMMARY
Prepared by Rabbi P. Feldman
of Kollel Iyun Hadaf, Yerushalayim
Rosh Kollel: Rabbi Mordecai Kornfeld
Ask A Question on the daf
Previous daf Bava Basra 21
BAVA BASRA 20-25 - sponsored by Harav Ari Bergmann of Lawrence,
N.Y., out of love for the Torah and for those who study it.
1) TEACHING TORAH TO CHILDREN
(a) (Rav Yehudah): Yehoshua ben Gamla prevented Torah from
being forgotten from Yisrael!
2) WHICH TEACHER TO TAKE
(b) Originally, a father taught his child Torah; an orphan
did not learn;
1. Question: Why was that?
(c) They enacted to establish teachers in Yerushalayim.
2. Answer: They expounded "v'Limadtem Osam" as 'Atem'
(you yourselves (the fathers) are commanded to teach
1. They learned from "U'Devar Hash-m mi'Yerushalayim".
(d) Still, fathers took their children to Yerushalayim, but
orphans did not go;
(e) They enacted to establish teachers in every province;
children would start learning at the age of 16 or 17.
(f) If the Rebbi got angry at the child, the child would
1. Yehoshua ben Gamla enacted to establish teachers in
every region and city, and that children would begin
learning at the age of six or seven.
(g) Rav (to Rav Shmuel bar Shilas): Do not accept to teach
children less than six;
1. After six, take them and stuff them with Torah.
(h) Question (Beraisa): People of a Chatzer can prevent a
member from setting up practice as a doctor, bloodletter,
weaver, or a teacher of children.
2. Only hit children with a shoe strap (it does not
hurt much or cause damage).
3. If a child is learning - fine;
i. If not, just put him with others that are
learning, he will also learn.
(i) Answer: That refers to teaching Nochri children.
(j) Question (Beraisa): Two people in a Chatzer, one can
prevent the other from setting up practice as a doctor,
bloodletter, weaver, or a teacher of children.
(k) Answer: That refers to teaching Nochri children.
(l) Question (Beraisa): One who owns a house in a joint
Chatzer, he may not rent it to a doctor, bloodletter,
weaver, or a Yisrael or Nochri teacher of children.
(m) Answer: That refers to the principal teacher of the city
(other teachers assist him, there is a great noise).
(n) (Rava): After Yehoshua ben Gamla's enactment, we do not
transport children from city to city (each city must get
its own teacher).
1. We do transport children from one synagogue to
(o) (Rava): A teacher should have 25 children; if there are
50 children, we get two teachers.
2. We do not transport children across a river, unless
there is a wide bridge across it.
1. If there are 40, the city hires an assistant to
(a) (Rava): If a teacher learns, and there is another teacher
available who learns more, we do not switch, lest the new
teacher will (be confident of his position and) take his
(b) Objection (Rav Dimi of Neharde'a): Just the contrary, he
will learn more - jealousy among Chachamim makes them
(c) (Rava): If there are two teachers, one learns more but
the other teaches more precisely, we prefer the former -
if he makes any mistakes, the children will later learn
the correct version;
(d) (Rav Dimi of Neharde'a): No, we take the latter - once a
child learned incorrectly, the mistake will stick with
1. "Yo'av...Hichris Kol Zachar b'Edom".
2. David: Why did you kill only the men?
3) INFRINGING ON ANOTHER'S LIVELIHOOD
3. Yo'av : "Timcheh Es Zachar (the males of) Amalek".
(e) (Rava): The following may be fired (for negligence)
without warning: one who teaches children, a planter, a
slaughterer, a bloodletter, and the town scribe (Rashi -
to write Sifrei Torah; Tosfos - to write documents);
4. David: The word is "Zecher (the remembrance of)"!
5. Yo'av: I was taught 'Zachar'!
6. They called Yo'av's Rebbi, who said that he taught
'Zecher'. Yo'av drew his sword to kill him (for not
having listened to how Yo'av learned the verse).
7. His Rebbi: Why do you want to kill me?
8. Yo'av: "Arur Oseh Meleches Hash-m Remiyah".
9. His Rebbi: Let it suffice that I am cursed!
10. Yo'av: "V'Arur Mone'a Charbo mi'Dam".
i. Some say, he killed him; others say, he did
1. The general rule is: any mistake that cannot be
corrected, we considered the worker to be warned.
(a) (Rav Huna): If a member of a Mavoy set up a mill (to
grind for wages, or to rent it out), he can stop someone
else in the Mavoy from setting one up, for this infringes
on his livelihood.
(b) Support (Beraisa): One who wants to spread a fish net
must distance himself from a fish (that another fisherman
has been following - Rashi; R. Gershom - from the net of
another fisherman) as far as a fish goes (from its
1. Question: How much is this?
(c) Rejection: That is different, for the first fisherman
invested food and is confident of getting the fish
(Rashi; Rabeinu Gershom - the second fisherman drops
food, which causes fish in the first one's trap to leave,
this is theft).
2. Answer (Rabah bar Rav Huna): A Parsah (about four
(d) Suggestion (Ravina): Rav Huna holds like R. Yehudah.
(e) (Mishnah - R. Yehudah): A grocer may not give treats to
children, for this accustoms them to patronize him;
Chachamim permit this.
(f) Rejection (Rava): He can even hold like Chachamim.
1. Chachamim only argue on R. Yehudah because the
grocer can say, just as I give nuts, you can give
(g) Question (Beraisa): One may set up a store next to
another's store, or a bathhouse next to another's
2. Chachamim agree that another person may not set up a
store in the Mavoy, for this infringes on the
livelihood of the first.
1. The first cannot protest, for each is on his own
(h) Answer: Tana'im argue about this.
1. People of a Mavoy may force one another not to rent
a house to a tailor, tanner, teacher of children or
a craftsman from outside the Mavoy (if someone in
the Mavoy does this);
(i) (Rav Huna brei d'Rav Yehoshua): Surely, someone can
prevent someone from another city from offering the same
service as he does;
i. One cannot prevent someone in the Mavoy from
offering the same service as he does.
ii. R. Shimon ben Gamliel says, he can prevent him.
1. If they both pay head-tax in the same city, he
cannot prevent him.
(j) Question (Rav Huna brei d'Rav Yehoshua): Can one prevent
someone from a different Mavoy?
2. One cannot prevent someone from the same Mavoy.
(k) This question is not resolved.
(l) (Rav Yosef): Rav Huna admits that one cannot prevent a
teacher of children from entering the same Mavoy;
1. Jealousy among Chachamim makes them learn better.