ANSWERS TO REVIEW QUESTIONS
prepared by Rabbi Eliezer Chrysler
Kollel Iyun Hadaf, Jerusalem
Previous daf Bava Basra 76
BAVA BASRA 76& 77- sponsored by Harav Ari Bergmann of Lawrence, N.Y., out of
love for the Torah and for those who study it.
(a) The Beraisa states 'Sefinah Nikneis bi'Meshichah'. Rebbi Nasan says -
'Sefinah ve'Osiyos (which means 'a Sh'tar-Chov') Niknos bi'Meshichah
(b) The problem with ...
1. ... Rebbi Nasan's statement is - that seeing as the Tana Kama did not
mention 'Osiyos', why does Rebbi Nasan mention it?
(c) So we amend Rebbi Nasan's statement to read 'Sefinah Niknos
bi'Meshichah, ve'Osiyos bi'Sh'tar'.
2. ... the Tana Kama (even after we add 've'Osiyos bi'Mesirah' to his
statement) is - why does Rebbi Nasan require a Sh'tar to acquire a ship
(which is after all, Metaltelin)?
(a) According to Rebbi Nasan, if one were to acquire 'Osiyos' with Mesirah
alone - he would acquire it, but only to use as a bottle-stopper (not to
(b) And when he says that one acquires Osiyos with a Sh'tar, he means - with
a Sh'tar (in order to acquire the contents of the Sh'tar and the Shibud) as
well as with Mesirah (with which he acquires the actual document).
(c) According to both Tana'im, one cannot acquire a Sh'tar-Chov with
Meshichah - because Meshichah only acquires something that has intrinsic
(d) Rebbi Nasan statement 'Sefinah bi'Meshichah' appears to tally with the
Tana Kama's opinion. Initially, we equate their Machlokes - with that of Rav
and Shmuel. The Tana Kama requires a full-scale Meshichah (the entire length
of the ship [like Shmuel]); whereas Rebbi Nasan requires only a slight
Meshichah (like Shmuel).
(a) We conclude that Rebbi Nasan and the Tana Kama do not argue with regard
to acquiring a ship through Meshichah - either according to Rav, or
according to Shmuel.
(b) They are arguing about whether one acquires Osiyos with Mesirah alone
(the Tana Kama), or whether one requires a Sh'tar too (Rebbi Nasan).
(c) This too, is not a new Machlokes - because it is an established
Machlokes between Rebbi and the Chachamim.
(d) Rebbi, in another Beraisa, says 'Osiyos Niknos bi'Mesirah'. According to
the Chachamim, one acquires a Sh'tar-Chov - with Mesirah and a Sh'tar (as we
explained in Rebbi Nasan).
(a) In another Beraisa, Rebbi says 'Sefinah Nikneis bi'Mesirah'. According
to the Chachamim - one acquires a ship either by means of Meshichah, or by
hiring the place where it is located.
(b) In that case, in spite of having established the Tana Kama of Rebbi
Nasan like Rebbi, one requires Meshichah to acquire the ship (and not with
Mesirah, like Rebbi) - because whereas Rebbi is speaking in the
Reshus-ha'Rabim (where Meshichah cannot acquire), the Rabbanan of Rebbi
Nasan are speaking in a Simta (an alleyway where it can).
(c) Mesirah is not Koneh in a Simta, because since it is available to
acquire with Meshichah (which by difinition, entails drawing the animal into
one's own domain), people tend not to use it for Mesirah.
(a) Abaye and Rava categorize the locations of the various Kinyanim.
Meshichah acquires in the Reshus ha'Rabim and in a Simta. The equivalent two
locations where Meshichah is Koneh are - a Simta and a Chatzer that is
jointly owned by both parties.
(b) Hagbahah acquires - everywhere.
(c) Even though Rebbi is speaking in a Reshus ha'Rabim, when the Chachamim
1. ... 'ad she'Yimshachenah', they mean - until he draws the animal from the
Reshus ha'Rabim into his domain.
2. ... 'O ad she'Yiskor es Mekomo', they mean to say - that if it would be
the owner's domain, then he would rent him the animal's location together
with the animal.
(a) We initially establish Abaye and Rava (with regard to Mesirah) - like
Rebbi (who holds that one can acquire a ship with Mesirah).
(b) We conclude however, that even the Chachamim would agree that a ship can
be acquired in the Reshus ha'Rabim with Mesirah - if the owner were to say
'Lech Chazek u'Keni'.
(c) They argue with Rebbi to require specifically Meshichah - in a case
where the owner said 'Lech Meshoch u'Keni', which he means literally,
according to them.
(d) And the reason that Rebbi nevertheless validates Mesirah is - because
his words were only an indication. What he really meant to say was that the
purchaser could now draw the ship into his domain, seeing as he had acquired
it with Mesirah.
(a) According to Rav Papa, someone who acquires a Sh'tar-Chov needs to
specify - that the purchaser should acquire the Sh'tar together with its
(b) He needs to specify this - in the Sh'tar, because he holds like the
Rabbanan of Rebbi, who require a Sh'tar together with Mesirah in order to
acquire a Sh'tar.
(c) Does this mean, Rav Ashi asked Rav Kahana, that if the seller fails to
write this, the purchaser only acquires the Sh'tar to use as a
bottle-stopper. Rav Ashi's Kashya is based on the fact - that he himself
holds like Rebbi ('Osiyos Niknos bi'Mesirah'), and that no Sh'tar is
(d) Rav Kahana replied - in the affirmative.