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prepared by Rabbi Eliezer Chrysler
Kollel Iyun Hadaf, Jerusalem

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Bava Basra 80

BAVA BASRA 80 (28 Sivan) - dedicated to the memory of Hagaon Rav Yisroel Zev [ben Rav Avrohom Tzvi] Gustman ZT'L (author of "Kuntresei Shi'urim" and renowned Dayan of pre and post-war Vilna) on his Yahrzeit, by a number of students who merited to study under him: Harav Lazar Stern and Harav Zalman Stern of Brooklyn; Yechiel Wachtel and Michoel Star of Yerushalayim.


(a) What is a 'B'reichah' (in connection with doves)?

(b) What is the birth-rate of doves?

(c) What does our Mishnah say about someone who sells one year's fruit of his dove-cot'? Why is that?

(a) What is a 'Nechil shel Devorim'?

(b) What does our Mishnah say about someone who sells one year's fruit of his bee-hive'?

(c) How often does a swarm of bees appear in the course of a year?

(d) From then on, the purchaser may perform Sirus.
What is 'Sirus'? Why does one do it?

(a) What are 'Chalos D'vash'? What do they consist of?

(b) How many Chalos is one likely to find in a bee-hive?

(c) What is the purpose of the two honey-combs that the purchaser leaves the owner, if he purchased one year's fruit of the bee-hive?

(d) What must Shimon leave for Reuven, if he purchased the branches of his olive-tree?

(a) We query our Mishnah, which requires the purchaser of the fruit of a dove-cot to leave one brood of doves for the owner, from a Beraisa, which requires him to leave two.
How does Rav Kahana interpret 'B'reichah Sheni'ah' of the Beraisa to resolve the discrepancy? Why does the Tana refer to it as B'reichah Sheni'ah (and not Rishonah)?

(b) Why is it necessary to leave over another brood as company for the first one? Why will the company of their mother not suffice (like their mother requires only *them*)?

(c) And why will its sibling not suffice as company? Why does it need its off-spring?

(a) How does Rav Yehudah Amar Shmuel explain Mesarsan' (stopping the bees from reproducing)? What does the owner do to achieve this?

(b) Do the mustard-seeds really stop the bees from reproducing?

(c) Rabeinu Chananel explains Rebbi Yossi b'Rebbi Chanina differently.
How does *he* explain his words?

(d) Why is that?

(a) Rebbi Yochanan interprets 'Mesarsan' quite differently.
What does it mean according to him?

(b) Rebbi Yochanan however, appears to have ignored the the 'Vav' of 'u'Mesarsan' in our Mishnah. The Halachah therefore, is like the Beraisa, which takes it into account.
What does the Beraisa say?

(a) Rav Kahana rules that honey in the beehive does not lose its status as food.
What are the ramifications of this ruling?

(b) Rav Kahana might mean that even in the beehive, when there are times that the bees eat the honey (as we just learned), the honey retains its status as a food (until otherwise stated). On the other hand, he might be referring specifically to honey in the hive. In that case, what is he saying? What status will the honey have once it flows from the beehive?

(c) How will the Din of honey differ once it becomes a beverage?

(d) This appears to contradict a Beraisa, which says to the contrary.
What does the Beraisa say about honey in a beehive?

Answers to questions



(a) Abaye resolves the problem by establishing the Beraisa by those two honey-combs.
What does he mean by that? Which two honey-combs?

(b) Rava disagrees with Abaye's interpretation of D'vash. He establishes the author of the Beraisa as Rebbi Eliezer (whereas Rav Kahana follows the opinion of the Chachamim).
What does Rebbi Eliezer say in the Mishnah in Shevi'is, about a beehive and its contents which will explain why the honey inside it is not considered food?

(c) Rebbi Elazar cites Rebbi Eliezer's source as the Pasuk in Shmuel (in connection with Yonasan ben Shaul) "va'Yitbol Osah be'Ya'aros ha'Devash". What does Rebbi Eliezer learn from there?

(a) The Beraisa states that once honey has flowed from a beehive, it is neither a food nor a beverage.
Why is this ...
  1. ... not a Kashya on Abaye (in Rav Kahana)?
  2. ... a Kashya on Rava (in Rav Kahana)?Why can Rava not simply establish the author as Rebbi Eliezer?
(b) To answer the Kashya on Rava, Rav Z'vid establishes the Beraisa when the honey flowed straight on to a dirty vessel (and the author must be Rebbi Eliezer).
Why is that? With which point would the Rabbanan disagree?

(c) Rav Acha bar Ya'akov establishes the Beraisa when the honey flowed on to little splinters of wood. What would he hold in a case where it flowed on to dirty vessels?

(a) Another Beraisa considers honey in the hive neither a food nor a beverage unless one has specifically in mind either the one or the other. How will Abaye establish the Beraisa (in Rav Kahana)?

(b) How does this Beraisa pose a Kashya on Rava (in Rav Kahana)?

(c) We answer by establishing the Beraisa like Rebbi Eliezer.
How do we amend the Beraisa (see Tosfos)?

(d) We finally cite a Beraisa in support of Rav Kahana.
What does the Beraisa say about honey in the beehive?

(a) If someone buys a tree to cut down and take away, he must leave one Tefach of the trunk standing for it to re-grow. How much is he obligated to leave of a ...
  1. ... a Besulas ha'Shikmah (a sycamore-tree that is being cut down for the first time)?
  2. ... a Sadan ha'Shikmah (a sycamore-tree that has been cut down before and has re-grown)?
  3. ... bamboo-trees and vines?
(b) Why, by date-palms and cedars-trees, may the purchaser take them out by the roots?

(c) On what grounds does the Beraisa forbid cutting down a 'Besulas ha'Shikmah in the Sh'mitah-year?

(d) Rebbi Yehudah forbids cutting it down in the normal way, only above ten Tefachim or down to the ground.
Why is that?

(a) What can we extrapolate from Rebbi Yehudah that creates an apparent discrepancy between this Beraisa and the previous one?

(b) How does Abaye differentiate between cutting a Besulas ha'Shikmah down to the ground and from there up to three Tefachim?

(c) How does that answer the Kashya? What is the difference between Shevi'is and a purchaser?

(a) Rebbi Chiya bar Luli'ani Darshens the Pasuk' 'in Tehilim "Tzadik ka'Tamar Yifrach, ke'Erez ba'Levanon Yisgeh".
Having written ...
  1. ... 'Tamar', why does the Pasuk find it necessary to write 'Erez'?
  2. ... 'Erez', why does the Pasuk need to write 'Tamar'?
(b) How do we reconcile this with the above Beraisa, that a purchaser is permitted to pull palms and cedars out by the roots - because they will not re-grow anyway?

(c) What do an oak-tree, a pine-tree, a myrtle-tree, a box-wood-tree and a balsam-tree have in common?

(d) How many more trees, besides the cedar itself, belonging to the same family ...

  1. ... does the Pasuk in Tehilim list?
  2. ... did the Chachamim add to the list, according to the testimony of Rav Dimi?
Answers to questions

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