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Chulin 84

CHULIN 81-84 - Sponsored by a generous grant from an anonymous donor. Kollel Iyun Hadaf is indebted to him for his encouragement and support and prays that Hashem will repay him in kind.

1) "KISUY HA'DAM" OF "KODSHIM" (cont.)

(g) Answer #1: Indeed, we cover blood of Korbanos ha'Of in this way;
1. The Mishnah teaches that Kisuy ha'Dam does not apply to Kodshim of Bedek ha'Bayis (because they may not be eaten.)
2. Question: Since we can redeem them (and eat them), we should do Kisuy!
3. Answer: Redemption of animals requires Ha'amadah and Ha'arachah (standing it up before a Kohen for appraisal) - this cannot be done after slaughter.
4. Question: Like whom is the Mishnah?
i. Suggestion: It is like R. Meir, who holds that even Kodshim of Bedek ha'Bayis require Ha'amadah and Ha'arachah.
ii. Rejection: He holds that even if slaughter does not permit the meat to be eaten, it is considered slaughter (and we must cover the blood)!
iii. Suggestion: The Mishnah is like R. Shimon, who says that slaughter that does not permit is not considered slaughter (so Kisuy is not needed.)
iv. Rejection: He holds that Kodshei Bedek ha'Bayis do not require Ha'amadah and Ha'arachah!
5. Answer #1 (Rav Yosef): The Mishnah is like Rebbi.
i. Rebbi holds like R. Shimon regarding slaughter that does not permit (it is not considered slaughter); he holds like R. Meir regarding redemption of Kodshei Bedek ha'Bayis.
6. Answer #2: The Mishnah is like R. Shimon; a verse teaches that the blood must be fit to be covered immediately.
i. "He will spill (the blood) and cover" - the blood must be fit to be covered immediately after slaughter;
ii. This excludes Kodshei Bedek ha'Bayis, which need not be covered until after redemption.
iii. This suggests another answer to Question 4:b (83B).
(h) Answer #2: The Mishnah also exempts Korbanos from Kisuy, since Kisuy cannot be done until the blood is scraped off the Mizbe'ach.
(i) Answer #3 (Mar bar Rav Ashi): The Mishnah also exempts Korbanos from Kisuy;
1. "Chayah O Of" - Kisuy applies to birds that are like Chayos, i.e. they are not Korbanos.
2. Suggestion: We should say that the verse discusses species of birds that are like Chayos, i.e. they are invalid for Kodshim;
i. This would exclude Torim and doves.
3. Rejection: The verse equates Chayos and birds - just like Kisuy applies to all species of Chayos, also regarding birds.
(a) Question (Yakov Mina'ah): The Torah gives Simanim of Kosher Behemos, they also apply to Chayos;
1. We should say, the Torah commands to cover the blood of Chayos, this also applies to Behemos!
(b) Answer (Rava): "On the ground you will spill it (Dam of blemished Korbanos, which are Behemos) like water" - just like water need not be covered, also Dam Behemah.
(c) Question: If blood of blemished Korbanos is equated to water, it should be valid for a Mikveh!
(d) Answer: "Ach Mayan u'Vor Mikveh Mayim Yihyeh Tahor" - only these (springs and pits of water), nothing else.
(e) Question: The verse should exclude other liquids, which are not called water, but not Dam!
(f) Answer: There are two exclusions in the verse - it is as if it said 'Mayan Mayim u'Vor Mayim'.
(g) Question: We should exclude two cases of other liquids - flowing or collected - but not blood, which is called water!
(h) Answer: There are three exclusions in the verse - it is as if it said 'Mayan Mayim u'Vor Mayim Mikveh Mayim'.
(i) (Beraisa): "Asher Yatzud" - one might have thought, if it was already trapped (e.g. domestic geese and chickens), the Mitzvah does not apply - "Tzeid" includes all cases.
(j) Question: If so, why did the Torah say "Asher Yatzud"?
(k) Answer: This teaches proper conduct, a person should not eat meat regularly, only after exertion.
(a) (Beraisa): "When Hash-m will expand your borders (...and you will lust to eat meat)" - this teaches proper behavior, one should eat meat only when he has a craving for it.
(b) Suggestion: Perhaps he may buy meat to eat.
(c) Rejection: "You will slaughter from your cattle and flock".
(d) Suggestion: Perhaps he may slaughter all his animals!
(e) Rejection: "*From* your cattle and *from* your flock" - not all of them.
1. (R. Eliezer ben Azaryah): If one has one Maneh (100 Zuz; two Manos is an average annual income, it is the threshhold of being considered poor), he should buy one Litra of vegetables; if he has 10 Manos, he should buy fish; if he has 50 Manos, he should buy meat; if he has 100 Manos, he should have meat every day.
2. Question: How often should people with 10 (and 50) eat fish (and meat)?
3. Answer: They should eat them only on Shabbos.
4. (Rav): We should follow R. Eliezer ben Azaryah's teaching.
5. (R. Yochanan): Rav was healthy, he could conduct like R. Eliezer ben Azaryah; we are not healthy, one who has money should spend it on food.
6. (Rav Nachman): We are so weak, we should borrow money to buy food.
(f) "Sheep for your clothing" - which you will make from their wool; "The price of a field (use to buy) goats" (they give milk and clothing.)
(g) "It is enough (for your sustenance), the milk of goats" - you should not slaughter them.
(h) "For your bread, for the bread of your household" - your bread comes before that of your household;
(i) (Mar Zutra brei d'Rav Nachman): "And life for your youths" - do not accustom your children to meat and wine (rather, to simple foods.)
(j) (R. Yochanan): To get rich, one should raise small animals.

1. (Rav Chisda): He learns from "Ashteros (the root is Ashir, wealth) Tzonecha" - they make their owners wealthy.
(k) (R. Yochanan): Lukewarm water is more hazardous than water on which witchcraft has been used.
1. This is only if the warm water was in a metal vessel (not earthenware), without spices, and was never boiled;
2. If any of these conditions is not met, the water is fine.
(l) (R. Yochanan): The following cause a person to lose his money - wearing linen garments, using glass vessels, and not supervising one's workers.
1. He refers to Roman linen and white glass, which are very expensive;
2. He refers to workers that plow with cattle - their negligence causes great losses.
(m) (Rav Avira): "Good is a gracious man that lends, he finances his matters properly" - a person should eat food less than his income dictates;
1. He should clothe himself according to his income;
2. He should honor his wife and children more than his income dictates, for they depend on him, and he depends on Hash-m.
(a) (Rav Eina): If one slaughters (a Chayah or bird) for a Choleh (dangerously sick person) on Shabbos, he must cover the blood.
(b) Question (Rabah - Beraisa - R. Yosi): We do not slaughter a Koy on Yom Tov; if it was slaughtered, a Kal va'Chomer teaches that Kisuy should not be done:
1. Circumcision overrides Shabbos if we know that it is the eighth day; if we are not sure, it does not override even Yom Tov;
2. Kisuy does not override Shabbos, even for a definite Chayah or bird - all the more so, it does not override Yom Tov for a Safek Chayah!
3. Objection #1 (Chachamim): Teki'as (sounding the) Shofar (on Rosh Hashanah) in the Gevulim (outside the Mikdash, or Yerushalayim, or the city where the Sanhedrin resides) disproves this - we do not blow on Shabbos even for a definite Mitzvah, but we blow on Yom Tov for a Safek (this will be explained)!
4. Objection #2 (R. Elazar ha'Hakapar Beribi): Kisuy applies even at times when circumcision does not, e.g. the night of Yom Tov, so one cannot learn from circumcision that Kisuy does not override Yom Tov for a Safek!
i. (R. Aba): R. Chiya could not challenge R. Yosi's Kal va'Chomer, until he heard R. Elazar ha'Hakapar's question.
5. (Summation of question (b)): It says that Kisuy does not override Shabbos, even for a definite Chayah or bird.
6. Suggestion: The case is, the slaughter was for a Choleh.
(c) Answer: Perhaps the slaughter was for a healthy person - since it was forbidden to slaughter, Kisuy is not done.
(d) Rejection: No, the slaughter is like circumcision (from which R. Yosi learns), which was permitted. (Rav Eina is refuted.)
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