POINT BY POINT SUMMARY
Prepared by Rabbi P. Feldman
of Kollel Iyun Hadaf, Yerushalayim
Rosh Kollel: Rabbi Mordecai Kornfeld
Ask A Question on the daf
Previous daf Kidushin 33
KIDUSHIN 32-35 - Ari Kornfeld has generously sponsored the Dafyomi
publications for these Dafim for the benefit of Klal Yisrael.
1) EXEMPTIONS FROM STANDING
(a) (Beraisa) Suggestion: Perhaps one must give money to the
Zaken to honor him.
2) HOW THE ZAKEN SHOULD ACT
(b) Rejection: "You will rise and honor" - just as one does
not lose money by rising, one does not lose by honoring.
(c) Question: Why is it clear that one does not lose money by
1. Doesn't the verse include the case of a man drilling
through pearls (to thread them), and he must stop
working when he rises?
(d) Answer: The verse equates rising to honoring - just as
one need not desist (from working) to honor, also to
1. The verse also equates honoring to rising - just as
one does not lose money by rising, one does not lose
(e) Question (Mishnah): (When people come to Yerushalayim
bringing Bikurim (first fruits), all craftsmen rise for
them, greet them and bless them.
i. From here we learn that craftsmen are not
allowed (Tosfos - some explain, obligated) to
rise for Chachamim.
(f) Answer (R. Yochanan): They must rise for people bringing
Bikurim, but not for Chachamim.
(g) (R. Yosi bar Avin): We see how great is one doing a
Mitzvah - he is honored more than Chachamim!
(h) Rejection: Perhaps he is not worthy of such honor; it was
enacted to honor people bringing Bikurim, lest they
decide not to come again.
(i) (Beraisa) Suggestion: Perhaps one must rise in the Beis
ha'Kisei or bathhouse...
(j) Question: Is one truly exempt?!
1. It twice happened that R. Shimon bar Rebbi walked by
Chachamim that had learned from him (R. Chiya and
Bar Kapara) in the bathhouse, and they did not rise
for him - R. Shimon was upset.
(k) Answer: One is obligated to rise in the outer rooms of a
bathhouse, not in the inner rooms.
2. Rebbi: Perhaps they were thinking about what you
taught them, and did not notice you.
i. If they did notice, they would be obligated to
1. Support: These cases must have been in the outer
rooms - Rabah bar bar Chanah taught, one may think
about Torah anywhere except for a Beis ha'Kisei or
(the inner rooms of) a bathhouse!
(l) (Beraisa) Suggestion: Perhaps one may close his eyes as
if he doesn't see the Zaken.
2. Rejection: Sometimes a Chacham cannot help but think
about Torah in these places.
1. Question: Does the Beraisa speak of wicked people?!
(m) Rejection: "You will rise and you will fear".
2. Answer: It means, perhaps one may close his eyes
before the Chacham is so close that he will have to
rise if he sees him.
(n) (Beraisa): Rising which shows honor is when the Chachamim
is within 4 Amos.
1. (Abaye): This is for a Chacham that is not his
primary Rebbi; for one's primary Rebbi, he must rise
as soon as he can see him.
(o) Abaye was riding on the bank of a river; Rav Mesharshiya
and other Chachamim were on the other side; they did not
2. Abaye would rise as soon as he saw the ear of the
donkey on which Rav Yosef (Abaye's Rebbi) used to
1. Abaye: Am I not your primary Rebi?
2. Chachamim: We did not notice you.
(a) (Beraisa): R. Shimon ben Elazar says, "Zaken, and you
will fear" - this teaches that he should not
unnecessarily cause people to stand for him.
1. (Abaye): If the Zaken takes a longer route to avoid
making people stand for him, his life will be
(b) Ravina was sitting before R. Yirmeyah mi'Difti; a man
passed by without covering his head.
2. Abaye and R. Zeira would normally take a longer
1. Ravina: That man is so brazen!
(c) (Isi ben Yehudah): "You will rise in front of an elder" -
2. R. Yirmeyah: Perhaps he is from the city of
Machseya, he always sees Chachamim.
(d) (R. Yochanan): The law is as Isi.
(e) R. Yochanan would rise for Nochri elders, because they
have experienced many afflictions and many miracles.
1. Rava would not rise for them, but he would show
2. Abaye would give them a hand.
3. Rava and Rav Nachman would send messengers to give
them a hand.
i. Rav Nachman felt it would belittle the honor of
Torah if he would help them himself.
3) RISING FOR ONE'S REBBI
(a) (R. Aibo): A Chachamim may not rise for his Rebbi more
than twice a day, morning and evening, in order that he
should not honor his Rebbi more than he honors Hash-m
(saying Shema Yisrael).
4) HOW FAR DOES ONE STAND FOR CHACHAMIM?
(b) Question (Beraisa - R. Shimon ben Elazar): "Zaken, you
will fear" - this teaches that a Zaken should not cause
that people will have to rise for him.
1. If people need only rise twice a day - they should
do so, what is wrong if he makes them rise?!
(c) Answer: Really, people need only rise twice a day;
2. It must be, they must rise every time he passes!
1. Still, the Zaken should minimize how much they must
rise for him.
(d) (R. Elazar): Any Chacham that does not rise for his Rebbi
is called wicked; he will not live long, he will forget
1. "An evil one will not live long...that does not fear
Hash-m" - this refers to rising for a Chacham, by
which it says "you will fear Hash-m".
(e) Question: If a son is his father's Rebbi, should he rise
for his father?
2. Question: Perhaps it refers to usury or false
measures, by which it says "you will fear Hash-m"!
3. Answer: R. Elazar learns a Gezeirah Shavah
(f) Answer: Yes - Shmuel told Rav Yehudah to rise for his
(g) Rejection: Rav Yehudah's father is an exception - he was
a great Tzadik, even Shmuel would rise for him.
(h) Question: If so, why did Shmuel have to tell Rav Yehudah
to rise for him? (Wasn't it to teach that a son must rise
for his father, even if he is his Rebbi?)
(i) Answer: He told him that when Rav Yehudah's father enters
after Shmuel, he should only rise when his father enters
(Shmuel pardoned the honor due to himself).
(j) Question: Must a man rise for his son, if his son is his
(k) Answer: R. Yehoshua ben Levi said, the only reason I rise
for my son is because he married into the family of the
1. Inference: This is because R. Yehoshua ben Levi was
his son's Rebbi - had he been his son's Talmid, that
would (also) require him to rise for him!
(l) Rejection: No - he meant, even if my son would be my
Rebbi, that would not obligate me to rise for him,
because he is my son;
1. I would only rise for him on account of the honor of
(m) Question: Is riding as walking (if a Chacham rides by,
must people rise for him)?
(n) Answer (Abaye - Mishnah): If a Tzaru'a sits under a tree
and a Tahor person stands underneath, he becomes Tamei;
1. If a Tzaru'a stands under a tree and a Tahor person
sits underneath, he remains Tahor;
(o) Question: Must one rise for a Sefer Torah?
2. If the Tzaru'a sat down, the Tahor person would
3. The same applies to a stone of a house with Tzara'as
(that a person holds under a tree).
i. (Rav Nachman bar Kohen): From this we learn
that riding is as walking (just as we judge the
stone as the person holding it, also we judge a
man riding as the animal carrying him, i.e. as
(p) Answer (R. Chilkiyah...): We stand for those that learn
Torah, all the more so for a Torah itself!
(q) R. Ilai and R. Yakov bar Zavdi rose for R. Shaman bar
1. (R. Shaman): That was unnecessary! Firstly, you are
i. Secondly, people engaging in Torah need not
stand for those that learn it!
ii. (R. Elazar): A Chacham is forbidden to rise for
his Rebbi while he is learning.
iii. Abaye would curse those that ruled as R.
(a) (R. Ami or R. Yitzchak Nafcha): "They looked at Moshe
until he entered the tent" - they looked condescendingly;
(b) (The other of R. Ami and R. Yitzchak Nafcha): This
teaches how long one must stand when the Nasi passes.
1. (Chizkiyah): One must rise when a Chacham comes
within 4 Amos; when he is 4 Amos away (as he
leaves), one may sit;
2. For the head of Beis Din - one must rise when one
sees him coming; when he is 4 Amos away, one may
3. For the Nasi - one must rise when one sees him
coming; when he sits in his place, one may sit -
"They looked at Moshe until he entered the tent".