ANSWERS TO REVIEW QUESTIONS
prepared by Rabbi Eliezer Chrysler
Kollel Iyun Hadaf, Jerusalem
Previous daf Nedarim 56
NEDARIM 56 - This daf has been dedicated l'Iluy Nishmas Esther Chaya Rayzel
(Friedman) bas Gershon Eliezer, mother of Jeri Turkel, Marcia Weinblatt and
Moshe Smulevitz, after the completion of the Shiv'a (Yahrzeit: 1 Elul). She
was a woman of valor who was devoted to her family and gave of herself
unstintingly, inspiring all those around her.
(a) According to Rebbi Meir in our Mishnah 'ha'Noder min ha'Bayis, Mutar
ba'Aliyah'. The Chachamim maintain - that a Neder on a house incorporates
(b) Someone who is Noder min ha'Aliyah - is permitted to live in the house,
according to everyone.
(c) The Beraisa Darshens from the Pasuk in Tazri'a "*be*'Veis Eretz
Achuzaschem" (with regard to Tzara'as on the house) to include the attic.
Rav Chisda establishes the Beraisa like Rebbi Meir - because, according to
the Chachamim, who hold that a 'house' automatically incorporates the attic,
we should not need a Pasuk to teach us that.
(d) Abaye disagrees, based on the Pasuk "be'Veis Eretz *Achuzaschem*" -
which seems to imply that the house must be attached to the ground (which
the attic is not). Consequently, even the Rabbanan will agree that a special
Pasuk is required to teach us otherwise.
(a) The Tana also Darshens "be'Veis", 'Lerabos es ha'Yatzi'a' (the gallery
or the extension). We reject this text however - on the basis of a Tosefta,
which Darshens exactly the opposite from the Pasuk "be'Kiros ha'Bayis"
've'Lo be'Kiros ha'Yatzi'a'.
(b) We change it to 'Lerabos es ha'Tzvu'a' (a painted room), which we would
otherwise have precluded from the Dinim of Tzara'as - because we would have
compared a house with Tzara'as to a garment with Tzara'as (and a colored
garment is not subject to Tzara'as).
(a) Rav Huna bar Chiya said in the name of Ula 'Bayis be'Veisi Ani Mocher
Lach, Mar'eihu Aliyah', from which we can infer - that if he had said S'tam
Bayis, he could not force the buyer to accept the attic.
(b) We suggest that Ula's statement follows the opinion of Rebbi Meir, who
holds that 'a house' does not incorporate the attic. In order to establish
the Beraisa even like the Rabbanan - we would have to explain 'Aliyah' to
mean 'Me'uleh she'be'Batim' (meaning that it is the purchaser who has the
upper-hand, because 'Bayis she'be'Batim' implies a good-quality house or
(c) According to our initial understanding of the Beraisa - the buyer cannot
argue that he bought a house, and not an attic - because (based on the
principle 'ha'Motzi me'Chaveiro, Alav ha'Re'ayah') the purchaser always has
(d) The Sugya in Menachos concludes like our initial understand of the Ula's
statement, in which case, the Halachah ought to be like Rebbi Meir.
Nevertheless, the Ramban establishes the Halachah like the Chachamim -
because the Sugya in Menachos does not agree with the inference that we made
from Ula's statement. In fact, what Ula meant, when he said 'Bayis
be'Veisi', is that even in there, the seller may force the purchaser to
accept an attic, and it is obvious that that will be the Din in a regular
case of Bayis S'tam.
(a) 'Rebbi Meir Omer ha'Noder min ha'Mitah, Mutar be'Dargesh' -
va'Chachamim Omrim, Dargesh bi'Chelal Mitah.
(b) If he is Noder min ha'Dargesh however - everyone agrees that beds are
(c) When the people came to participate in the Se'udas Havra'ah (the first
meal that one serves an Aveil) of the King who became an Aveil - they would
sit on the floor, whilst he sat on a Dargesh.
(d) We initially try to prove from this Mishnah too, that a Dargesh cannot
be a bed that was made for good Mazel, but not to sleep on, because if it
was - why should the King sit on a surface which he did not sit on the whole
(a) We refute the previous Kashya however, on the grounds that one also
serves an Aveil meat and wine, even though he may well not partake of them
the whole year round. So we try to disprove our initial suggestion from the
Beraisa which requires the Dargesh to be stood upright, but not overturned.
Now if, as we currently believe, a Dargesh is a bed that is made for good
Mazel - why should it be different than any other bed, about which the
Beraisa says 'Ela Kol Mitos she'Yesh Lo ba'Bayis Hu Kofeh'?
(b) This too is not a problem however, because we have a precedent of other
beds that are exceptions to the rule, and which do not need to be
overturned - such as beds which are designated for vessels (see Rosh DH
(c) We finally refute the current explanation from another Beraisa, where
Raban Shimon ben Gamliel says 'Dargesh Matir Karbitav ('its loops'), ve'Hu
Nofel me'Eilav' - and a Dargesh does not have loops.
(d) Both the Chachamim and Raban Shimon ben Gamliel agree that a Dargesh
does not need to be overturned - because, unlike a bed, its posts do not
protrude above the height of the frame, in which case, overturning it would
cause the leather mattress to become dirty.
(a) We have proved that a Dargesh is not a bed that is designated for
Mazel - so Ravin quoting Rav Tachlifa bar Ma'arva defines it as a tanner's
bed or sofa.
(b) Ravin was certain that Rav Tachlifa bar Ma'arva was right - because he
often frequented the tanner's market.
(c) Rebbi Yirmiyah initially thinks that they tied the leather mattress to
the bed by winding its straps round the poles of the frame in opposite
directions and then tying them together. In that case - they would have tied
the mattress to the Dargesh by pushing the straps through the narrow holes
in the poles and then tying them together with a bow.
(a) According to the Beraisa, wooden beds and babies-cribs become subject to
Tum'ah - as soon as they have been rubbed smooth with the skin of fish (the
olden-day equivalent of sand-paper).
(b) This disproves Rebbi Yirmiyah's theory that one ties the mattress to the
bed by winding the straps around the poles of the frame - because if that
was so, why would it be necessary to smoothen the poles, seeing as they
would be covered anyway.
(c) So we are forced to conclude that the mattress of a bed, like that of a
Dargesh, was attached to the frame by pushing the straps through holes in
the posts and tying them with a bow. What distinguishes a Dargesh from a bed
(besides the different heights of the bed-posts) - is that the former had
loops which were pre-attached to its poles, and to which he tied the straps
of the mattress.
(d) Finally, Rebbi Yehoshua ben Levi rules that with regard to ...
1. ... a Dargesh - one simply unties the knots and lets it fall, like Raban
Shimon ben Gamliel.
2. ... a two-poster bed, which cannot be overturned - must be stood upright.
(a) We have learned in our Mishnah 'ha'Noder min ha'Ir, Mutar Likaneis
li'Techumah shel Ir, ve'Asur Likaneis le'Iburah'. The definition of ...
1. ... 'T'chumah shel Ir' - is the two thousand Amos surrounding it (beyond
(b) The Tana continues 'Aval ha'Noder min ha'Bayis, Asur min ha'Egef
ve'Lifnim' - meaning that a house or room incorporates the space taken up by
the door (when the door is open).
2. ... 'Iburah shel Ir' - is the first seventy Amos immediately outside its
(a) Rebbi Yochanan derives from the Pasuk "Vayehi bi'Heyos Yehoshua
bi'Yericho ... ", that the Ibur of the city is considered part of the city -
because otherwise, in view of the Pasuk there "vi'Yericho Sogeres
u'Mesugeres" (rendering it inaccessible), the first Pasuk would make no
sense, seeing as Yehoshua could not possibly have been inside Yericho.
(b) We know that this Pasuk refers to the Ibur and not to the T'chum -
because another Pasuk (with reference to the T'chum) writes "u'Madosem
(a) With regard to the Kohen locking up a house which has signs of
Tzara'as, the Torah writes "ve'Yatza ha'Kohen min ha'Bayis". We know that
this does not mean that he must (or that he may) go home and close it from
there - because the Torah also writes there "el Pesach ha'Bayis".
(b) He would do that - with the help of a long ball of string, one end of
which would be tied to the door of the stricken house.
(c) We then learn from " ...min ha'Bayis" - that the Kohen must leave the
jamb of the door (i.e. the lintel, even the section that is beyond the point
where the door closes), before closing the door of the house.
(d) If the Kohen went home before shutting the house, or if he did so whilst
standing underneath the lintel, he has nevertheless performed his duty
(a) We reconcile the fact that Lechatchilah the Kohen must leave the entire
door-jamb, even the section that is beyond the closed door, with what we
just learned (that *that* section is no longer considered part of the
house - by pointing to the redundant words ("min ha'Bayis"), from which we
learn that the Kohen must leave the entire lintel (even though the outer
section is not really part of the house).
(b) If someone makes a Neder to stand in a house - he will not fulfill his
Neder if he stands beneath the outer section of the lintel (beyond the point
where the door closes).